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Ver la versión completa : Antiquísimo discurso a los griegos PAGANOS acerca del HADES cristianizado



Emeric
06/09/2015, 08:34
Fue atribuido a Flavio Josefo, pero se dice que su autor fue Hipólito de Roma ...

Bueno, en todo caso, lo interesante es que este documento recoge la creencia en la vida después de a muerte en un lugar que coincide en varios puntos con lo que expresó Jesucristo cuando contó lo ocurrido a un hombre rico y a un hombre muy pobre, tiempo después de Abraham, y Moisés.

No lo he encontrado en español. Así que los que no leen el inglés me disculparán. Saludos.


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1. NOW as to Hades, wherein the souls of the of the good things they see, and rejoice in the righteous and unrighteous are detained, it is necessary to speak of it. Hades is a place in the world not regularly finished; a subterraneous region, wherein the light of this world does not shine; from which circumstance, that in this region the light does not shine, it cannot be but there must be in it perpetual darkness. This region is allotted as a place of custody for souls, in which angels are appointed as guardians to them, who distribute to themtemporary punishments, agreeable to every one's behavior and manners.


2. In this region there is a certain place set apart, as a lake of unquenchable fire, whereinto we suppose no one hath hitherto been cast; but it is prepared for a day afore-determined by God, in which one righteous sentence shall deservedly be passed upon all men; when the unjust, and those that have been disobedient to God, and have given honor to such idols as have been the vain operations of the hands of men as to God himself, shall be adjudged to this everlasting punishment, as having been the causes of defilement; while the just shall obtain an incorruptible and never-fading kingdom. These are now indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place wherein the unjust are confined.


3. For there is one descent into this region, at whose gate we believe there stands an archangel with an host; which gate when those pass through that are conducted down by the angels appointed over souls, they do not go the same way; but the just are guided to the right hand, and are led with hymns, sung by the angels appointed over that place, unto a region of light, in which the just have dwelt from the beginning of the world; not constrained by necessity, but ever enjoying the prospect of the good things they see, and rejoic in the expectation of those new enjoyments which will be peculiar to every one of them, and esteeming those things beyond what we have here; with whom there is no place of toil, no burning heat, no piercing cold, nor are any briers there; but the countenance of the and of the just, which they see, always smiles them, while they wait for that rest and eternal new life in heaven, which is to succeed this region. This place we call The Bosom of Abraham.


4. But as to the unjust, they are dragged by force to the left hand by the angels allotted for punishment, no longer going with a good-will, but as prisoners driven by violence; to whom are sent the angels appointed over them to reproach them and threaten them with their terrible looks, and to thrust them still downwards. Now those angels that are set over these souls drag them into the neighborhood of hell itself; who, when they are hard by it, continually hear the noise of it, and do not stand clear of the hot vapor itself; but when they have a near view of this spectacle, as of a terrible and exceeding great prospect of fire, they are struck with a fearful expectation of a future judgment, and in effect punished thereby: and not only so, but where they see the place [or choir] of the fathers and of the just, even hereby are they punished; for a chaos deep and large is fixed between them; insomuch that a just man that hath compassion upon them cannot be admitted, nor can one that is unjust, if he were bold enough to attempt it, pass over it.


5. This is the discourse concerning Hades, wherein the souls of all men are confined until a proper season, which God hath determined, when he will make a resurrection of all men from the dead, not procuring a transmigration of souls from one body to another, but raising again those very bodies, which you Greeks, seeing to be dissolved, do not believe [their resurrection]. But learn not to disbelieve it; for while you believe that the soul is created, and yet is made immortal by God, according to the doctrine of Plato, and this in time, be not incredulous; but believe that God is able, when he hath raised to life that body which was made as a compound of the same elements, to make it immortal; for it must never be said of God, that he is able to do some things, and unable to do others. We have therefore believed that the body will be raised again; for although it be dissolved, it is not perished; for the earth receives its remains, and preserves them; and while they are like seed, and are mixed among the more fruitful soil, they flourish, and what is sown is indeed sown bare grain, but at the mighty sound of God the Creator, it will sprout up, and be raised in a clothed and glorious condition, though not before it has been dissolved, and mixed [with the earth]. So that we have not rashly believed the resurrection of the body; for although it be dissolved for a time on account of the original transgression, it exists still, and is cast into the earth as into a potter's furnace, in order to be formed again, not in order to rise again such as it was before, but in a state of purity, and so as never to he destroyed any more. And to every body shall its own soul be restored. And when it hath clothed itself with that body, it will not be subject to misery, but, being itself pure, it will continue with its pure body, and rejoice with it, with which it having walked righteously now in this world, and never having had it as a snare, it will receive it again with great gladness. But as for the unjust, they will receive their bodies not changed, not freed from diseases or distempers, nor made glorious, but with the same diseases wherein they died; and such as they were in their unbelief, the same shall they be when they shall be faithfully judged.


6. For all men, the just as well as the unjust, shall be brought before God the word: for to him hath the Father committed all judgment : and he, in order to fulfill the will of his Father, shall come as Judge, whom we call Christ. For Minos and Rhadamanthus are not the judges, as you Greeks do suppose, but he whom God and the Father hath glorified: CONCERNING WHOM WE HAVE ELSEWHERE GIVEN A MORE PARTICULAR ACCOUNT, FOR THE SAKE OF THOSE WHO SEEK AFTER TRUTH. This person, exercising the righteous judgment of the Father towards all men, hath prepared a just sentence for every one, according to his works; at whose judgment-seat when all men, and angels, and demons shall stand, they will send forth one voice, and say, JUST IS THY JUDGMENT; the rejoinder to which will bring a just sentence upon both parties, by giving justly to those that have done well an everlasting fruition; but allotting to the lovers of wicked works eternal punishment. To these belong the unquenchable fire, and that without end, and a certain fiery worm, never dying, and not destroying the body, but continuing its eruption out of the body with never-ceasing grief: neither will sleep give ease to these men, nor will the night afford them comfort; death will not free them from their punishment, nor will the interceding prayers of their kindred profit them; for the just are no longer seen by them, nor are they thought worthy of remembrance. But the just shall remember only their righteous actions, whereby they have attained the heavenly kingdom, in which there is no sleep, no sorrow, no corruption, no care, no night, no day measured by time, no sun driven in his course along the circle of heaven by necessity, and measuring out the bounds and conversions of the seasons, for the better illumination of the life of men; no moon decreasing and increasing, or introducing a variety of seasons, nor will she then moisten the earth; no burning sun, no Bear turning round [the pole], no Orion to rise, no wandering of innumerable stars. The earth will not then be difficult to be passed over, nor will it he hard to find out the court of paradise, nor will there be any fearful roaring of the sea, forbidding the passengers to walk on it; even that will be made easily passable to the just, though it will not be void of moisture. Heaven will not then be uninhabitable by men, and it will not be impossible to discover the way of ascending thither. The earth will not be uncultivated, nor require too much labor of men, but will bring forth its fruits of its own accord, and will be well adorned with them. There will be no more generations of wild beasts, nor will the substance of the rest of the animals shoot out any more; for it will not produce men, but the number of the righteous will continue, and never fail, together with righteous angels, and spirits [of God], and with his word, as a choir of righteous men and women that never grow old, and continue in an incorruptible state, singing hymns to God, who hath advanced them to that happiness, by the means of a regular institution of life; with whom the whole creation also will lift up a perpetual hymn from corruption, to incorruption, as glorified by a splendid and pure spirit. It will not then be restrained by a bond of necessity, but with a lively freedom shall offer up a voluntary hymn, and shall praise him that made them, together with the angels, and spirits, and men now freed from all bondage.


7. And now, if you Gentiles will be persuaded by these motives, and leave your vain imaginations about your pedigrees, and gaining of riches, and philosophy, and will not spend your time about subtleties of words, and thereby lead your minds into error, and if you will apply your ears to the hearing of the inspired prophets, the interpreters both of God and of his word, and will believe in God, you shall both be partakers of these things, and obtain the good things that are to come; you shall see the ascent unto the immense heaven plainly, and that kingdom which is there. For what God hath now concealed in silence [will be then made manifest,] what neither eye hath seen, nor ear hath heard, nor hath it entered into the heart of man, the things that God hath prepared for them that love him.


8. In whatsoever ways I shall find you, in them shall I judge you entirely: so cries the END of all things. And he who hath at first lived a virtuous lift, but towards the latter end falls into vice, these labors by him before endured shall be altogether vain and unprofitable, even as in a play, brought to an ill catastrophe. Whosoever shall have lived wickedly and luxuriously may repent; however, there will be need of much time to conquer an evil habit, and even after repentance his whole life must be guarded with great care and diligence, after the manner of a body, which, after it hath been a long time afflicted with a distemper, requires a stricter diet and method of living; for though it may be possible, perhaps, to break off the chain of our irregular affections at once, yet our amendment cannot be secured without the grace of God, the prayers of good men, the help of the brethren, and our own sincere repentance and constant care. It is a good thing not to sin at all; it is also good, having sinned, to repent; as it is best to have health always, but it is a good thing to recover from a distemper. To God be glory and dominion for ever and ever Amen.

Fuente : sacred-texts.com

Emeric
07/09/2015, 04:51
Adventistas y watchtowerianos : Aprendan de la propia historia doctrinal de la antigüedad cristopaulina.

Emeric
07/09/2015, 09:00
¿ Vieron que el Hades y el lago de fuego son dos lugares diferentes ? Igualito que en el Apocalipsis de Juan.

Emeric
07/09/2015, 09:43
Digo Hades cristianizado porque harto sabido es que el Hades pertenece a la mitología griega, es decir, es anterior a Jesucristo y a Sus apóstoles, especialmente Pedro y Juan. Ellos tres retomaron el Hades griego, y lo introdujeron en su propia doxa.

crisol
07/09/2015, 09:46
Digo Hades cristianizado porque harto sabido es que el Hades pertenece a la mitología griega, es decir, es anterior a Jesucristo y a Sus apóstoles, especialmente Pedro y Juan. Ellos tres retomaron el Hades griego, y lo introdujeron en su propia doxa.

Lo Que Pasa Es que desconocen el verdadero Lugar Emeric.

Emeric
07/09/2015, 18:17
"These are now indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place wherein the unjust are confined".

¿ Vieron que eso coincide con lo que contó Jesucristo acerca del rico y Lázaro ?

Emeric
16/09/2015, 03:59
Se han quedado mudos ...

Emeric
30/09/2015, 18:05
Davidmor : No te pierdas este tema ...

ontaotto
30/09/2015, 18:14
Yo tenía muy en claro que Hades era un espíritu ya que la Biblia narra que al final de los tiempos, éste junto con la muerte, el mar, la bestia..serán arrojados al lago de fuego para tormento eterno, pero una vez también tu me dijiste que cuando se habla de Hades se habla de ambas cosas, el espíritu que gobierna ahí y el lugar.

Habría que encontrar los pasajes que hacen referencia a ambos verdad?

Emeric
01/10/2015, 02:13
una vez también tu me dijiste que cuando se habla de Hades se habla de ambas cosas, el espíritu que gobierna ahí y el lugar.Según la mitología griega, así es. En cambio, en su Apocalipsis, Juan habla del Hades como lugar; no como espíritu.

Emeric
01/10/2015, 20:49
Davidmor : No te pierdas este tema ...El debe de estar buscando en "Perspicacia" algo que copiar y pegar ... Je, je ...

ontaotto
05/10/2015, 15:04
Según la mitología griega, así es. En cambio, en su Apocalipsis, Juan habla del Hades como lugar; no como espíritu.


Ahi es donde yo difiero, el Apocalipsis habla a cerca del castigo eterno del Hades, cómo un lugar puede ser atormentado?

Apocalipsis 20:14Y la muerte y el Hades fueron lanzados al lago de fuego. Esta es la muerte segunda.

Emeric
05/10/2015, 17:37
cómo un lugar puede ser atormentado?No dice que el Hades como lugar será atormentado, sino echado o incluido en el lago de fuego.

ontaotto
06/10/2015, 12:29
No dice que el Hades como lugar será atormentado, sino echado o incluido en el lago de fuego.

Para tormento eterno y no como un acto de destrucción, por eso digo que a un lugar no se le puede atormentar, como sí a un ser espiritual.

LuisEduardoP
06/10/2015, 14:32
¿ Vieron que el Hades y el lago de fuego son dos lugares diferentes ? Igualito que en el Apocalipsis de Juan.

Fíjate que en algún escrito (no recuerdo de qué autor) comenta lo mismo, y describe que por lago de fuego se referían al basurero afuera de la ciudad donde todo se quemaba todo desperdicio (basurero) y que de manera permanente estaba ardiendo, que era común en esos días entre los judíos referirse a ese basurero como el fuego que ardía de manera eterna. Lo buscaré para ser más exacto en los comentarios del autor que hoy no lo recuerdo.

Saludos.

Emeric
07/10/2015, 15:04
Para tormento eterno y no como un acto de destrucción, por eso digo que a un lugar no se le puede atormentar, como sí a un ser espiritual.Efectivamente.

Emeric
20/10/2015, 17:40
Fíjate que en algún escrito (no recuerdo de qué autor) comenta lo mismo, y describe que por lago de fuego se referían al basurero afuera de la ciudad donde todo se quemaba todo desperdicio (basurero) y que de manera permanente estaba ardiendoPor eso fue que Jesucristo habló del Gehenna, o Valle del hijo de Hinón, y lo tomó como modelo terrenal para referirse al lago de fuego, lugar literal de castigo final y eterno de los perdidos.

ontaotto
20/10/2015, 17:57
Una gran contradicción o incomprensión del infierno es que mucha gente piensa que ya existe...

Emeric
20/10/2015, 18:52
Una gran contradicción o incomprensión del infierno es que mucha gente piensa que ya existe...En la óptica bíblica, quizás ya existe, pero todavía está vacío.

Emeric
16/11/2015, 19:03
Adventistas y watchtowerianos : Aprendan de la propia historia doctrinal de la antigüedad cristopaulina.Se han esfumado de estos foros ...

Emeric
13/01/2016, 19:40
Bueno, ahora tenemos a Afri, adventista ...

Emeric
14/01/2016, 19:35
Eli yahu, watchtoweriano, está conectado. Veamos si viene ...

Seeker
14/01/2016, 20:56
Wow!!! Explica lo que habíamos disernido en la congregacion, de que el Hades es para justos e injustos solo que en habitaciones diferentes del mismo, es sin duda muy interesante. Gracias por el aporte Emeric.

Los malhechores en el Tártaro???? y los justos en el seno de Abraham.????

El inglés aca usado es bastante Propio del Medievo pero muy comprensible.
Es e efecto una replica más profunda del relato de Lazaro y el Rico.

El Hades es verdaderamente, un equivalente de Seol según esto, pero mejor descrito.

Ello tambien explicaría por qué Samuel dijo lo siguiente a Saúl cuando había sido traído de entre los muertos:

"Y Jehová entregará a Israel también contigo en manos de los filisteos; y mañana estaréis conmigo, tú y tus hijos"

Esto va para el templo. ^^ gracias.

P.D.
Si bien no debatire tus niñerias, al menos comentaré en cuanto a aportes semejantes. Ninive Celebra. ^^

Emeric
15/01/2016, 20:18
Wow!!! Explica lo que habíamos disernido en la congregacionEntre paréntesis : ¿ A qué congregación vas ? Es para ubicarte correctamente.

Emeric
22/01/2016, 11:48
Bueno, ahora tenemos a Afri, adventista ...Coméntanos algo, Afri ...

Emeric
31/01/2016, 14:22
Anímate, chicooooooooo ...

Emeric
11/02/2016, 19:45
No viene Afri ...

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5vluryDJHfi7srJ0LExz8Zqdlatqlq dNdrljz_5irFJG4GBmikg

Emeric
26/02/2016, 11:23
Eli yahu, watchtoweriano, está conectado. Veamos si viene ...No vino. Lo comprendo.

Emeric
16/03/2016, 17:01
Para Gloria ... Saludos.

Emeric
07/04/2016, 09:04
Eli yahu, watchtoweriano, está conectado. Veamos si viene ...No vino ... Hmmmmm ...

Emeric
07/04/2016, 19:22
Está conectado ahora mismo. A ver si viene por aquí ....

Emeric
14/04/2016, 18:00
No vino (Eli yahu, watchtowearriano).

Emeric
21/04/2016, 11:09
Lean bien desde arriba antes de hacer sus comentarios.

Emeric
16/06/2016, 05:30
Sido esperándote, Eli yahu ...

Emeric
27/08/2016, 12:23
LPV tampoco vino.

Emeric
12/09/2016, 08:53
Ni Davidmor ...

Davidmor
12/09/2016, 08:56
"These are now indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place wherein the unjust are confined".

¿ Vieron que eso coincide con lo que contó Jesucristo acerca del rico y Lázaro ?

Es normal, pués el Satanas, sabe como son las cosas, y para confundir inspiro a sus "profetas" (¿igual que a ti?) a escribir relatos parecidos a los que iba a contar Jesucristo.

Emeric
12/09/2016, 09:00
Es normal, pués el Satanas, sabe como son las cosas, y para confundir inspiro a sus "profetas" (¿igual que a ti?) a escribir relatos parecidos a los que iba a contar Jesucristo.
Davidmor : Hay un Foro de Chistes, incluso para chistes tan malos como ése.

Davidmor
12/09/2016, 09:05
Davidmor : Hay un Foro de Chistes, incluso para chistes tan malos como ése.

Esa es la verdad. Tal y como dice la Biblia

Satanás mismo sigue transformándose en ángel de luz.” (2 CORINTIOS 11:14.)

“Satanás mismo sigue transformándose en ángel de luz. No es, por lo tanto, gran cosa el que sus ministros también sigan transformándose en ministros de justicia. Pero su fin será conforme a sus obras”. (2 Corintios 11:14, 15.)

“El mundo entero yace en el poder del inicuo”, señala la Biblia. Jesús dijo que Satanás era “homicida cuando principió, [...] mentiroso y el padre de la mentira”. (1 Juan 5:19; Juan 8:44.)

Las Escrituras llaman a Satanás “el padre de la mentira”, aquel que “sigue transformándose en ángel de luz” y que “está extraviando a toda la tierra habitada” junto con sus demonios (Juan 8:44; 2 Corintios 11:14; Revelación [Apocalipsis] 12:9). En efecto, Satanás se inventó la idea de que, al morir, nos sobrevive un alma que puede causar daño a los vivos.

Emeric
12/09/2016, 09:07
Fuera de tema, todo eso. Pssss ...

Davidmor
12/09/2016, 09:08
Esa es la verdad. Tal y como dice la Biblia

Satanás mismo sigue transformándose en ángel de luz.” (2 CORINTIOS 11:14.)

“Satanás mismo sigue transformándose en ángel de luz. No es, por lo tanto, gran cosa el que sus ministros también sigan transformándose en ministros de justicia. Pero su fin será conforme a sus obras”. (2 Corintios 11:14, 15.)

“El mundo entero yace en el poder del inicuo”, señala la Biblia. Jesús dijo que Satanás era “homicida cuando principió, [...] mentiroso y el padre de la mentira”. (1 Juan 5:19; Juan 8:44.)

Las Escrituras llaman a Satanás “el padre de la mentira”, aquel que “sigue transformándose en ángel de luz” y que “está extraviando a toda la tierra habitada” junto con sus demonios (Juan 8:44; 2 Corintios 11:14; Revelación [Apocalipsis] 12:9). En efecto, Satanás se inventó la idea de que, al morir, nos sobrevive un alma que puede causar daño a los vivos.

Algunas similitudes de otras "religones" (religiones del diablo y sus demonios) con la religión de la Biblia (la verdadera religión del Dios todopoderoso), es debido a que los demonios copian parte de las doctrinas de Jehová y las tuercen.

Emeric
12/09/2016, 13:16
los demonios copian parte de las doctrinas de Jehová y las tuercen.Los demonios no escriben. Pssss ...

Emeric
17/09/2016, 08:02
Sigan participando, pero en serio ... :yo:

Davidmor
17/09/2016, 08:18
Los demonios no escriben. Pssss ...

Escriben sus profetas a quienes inspiran.

Emeric
17/09/2016, 13:34
Escriben sus profetas a quienes inspiran.Como Russell y Rutherford. :lol:

Emeric
26/10/2016, 15:50
Davidmor se evaporó. :rapture:

Emeric
11/11/2016, 17:26
Bueno, ahora tenemos a Afri, adventista ...A ver si otros adventistas se animan, y vienen por aquí ...

Emeric
23/11/2016, 16:09
O ex-adventistas, como Curado ...

Emeric
23/01/2017, 10:02
O testigos de Jehová, como Boaz ...

Emeric
06/03/2017, 05:08
Huyen todos. :bolt:

Emeric
23/04/2017, 20:04
Aprende, rpjuan ...

Emeric
01/06/2017, 12:43
Se esfumó ... :rapture:

Emeric
17/07/2017, 03:20
A qui le tour, à présent ??

Emeric
05/08/2017, 18:41
Max : Otro tema que te va a interesar ... :yo:

Emeric
05/09/2017, 10:59
Ya que eres negacionista ...

Emeric
01/10/2017, 17:31
No vino Max. Para que vean ...

Emeric
07/11/2017, 09:34
Who's next ??????

Emeric
26/11/2017, 06:36
Entérate, Ruth Esther, adventista.

Emeric
27/11/2017, 08:50
¿Por qué no abordas este tema, chica ????

Emeric
01/12/2017, 08:14
Who's next ?????

Emeric
03/01/2018, 15:31
Aprende tú también, Slave, nuevo forista watchtowearriano. :yo:

Emeric
11/02/2018, 06:59
No reaccionas, ¿ eh ??? :eyebrows:

Emeric
31/07/2018, 09:48
Huyen los testigos de Jehová ... :bolt:

Emeric
11/01/2019, 11:34
Ahora se llaman FUGITIVOS de Jehová. :pound: